[Carved]

http://www.boston.com/business/news...le-wanxiang/7f3XUDluIXFCvx1W3QVsEK/story.html

 

[Eric Karma]

http://www.boston.com/business/news...le-wanxiang/7f3XUDluIXFCvx1W3QVsEK/story.html

Not yet final.....

"The purchase, which requires clearance under federal antitrust law, includes an abandoned General Motors Co. plant in Wilmington that Fisker acquired in 2010."

"The deal is also subject to clearance under the Hart-Scott- Rodino Antitrust Improvements Act of 1976, according to Anita- Marie Laurie, an outside spokeswoman for Fisker with Sitrick and Co. The act requires individuals and companies over a certain size to adhere to notification and waiting period conditions before they complete acquisitions resulting in holding stock or assets above specified thresholds."

 

[Carved]

What is the waiting time?

 

[marswill]

In the document "Case 13-13087-KG Doc 634-1 Filed 02/17/14 Page 2 of 70" on page 13 it states:
"1.10 Limited Warranty Program. Buyer hereby assumes and agrees to honor the
obligations of Sellers under the Sellers’ limited warranties on “Karma” sedans existing as of the
date hereof in an amount not to exceed (i) $2,000 per each vehicle warrantied or (ii) $400,000 in
the aggregate; provided that, at such point in time when Buyer and its Affiliates have restarted
commercial production of the “Karma” sedan (or substantially equivalent model under a
different name) and upon the production of the 250th such vehicle, the aggregate obligation set
forth in clause (ii) will be increased by $1,000,000."

 

[msajidkhan]

It means we will have our warranty back ?

 

[Karma 2012]

In the document "Case 13-13087-KG Doc 634-1 Filed 02/17/14 Page 2 of 70" on page 13 it states:
"1.10 Limited Warranty Program. Buyer hereby assumes and agrees to honor the
obligations of Sellers under the Sellers’ limited warranties on “Karma” sedans existing as of the
date hereof in an amount not to exceed (i) $2,000 per each vehicle warrantied or (ii) $400,000 in
the aggregate; provided that, at such point in time when Buyer and its Affiliates have restarted
commercial production of the “Karma” sedan (or substantially equivalent model under a
different name) and upon the production of the 250th such vehicle, the aggregate obligation set
forth in clause (ii) will be increased by $1,000,000."

Will any lawyer from this group translate this to plain English? :huh: I take this as a positive statement regarding warranty for us early adopters or "ambassadors" of the brand as Henrik called us.

 

[dennis]

$2000 per vehicle warranty cap only buys 15% of a battery, even at cost ($14K).

 

[SoCalGuy]

And it will be capped at $400K which means likely 200 Karmas. If/when Wax restarts production and makes at least 250 cars similar to the Karma, then an additional $1M will be added to the cap, meaning another 500 current Karmas can avail themselves of the $2K warranty credit.

 

[smggsm]

And it will be capped at $400K which means likely 200 Karmas. If/when Wax restarts production and makes at least 250 cars similar to the Karma, then an additional $1M will be added to the cap, meaning another 500 current Karmas can avail themselves of the $2K warranty credit.

you mean the new 250 cars will have only $2k warranty .. who will buy a car with 2000$ warranty..? if that their new marketing strategy make new cars with limited warranty and screw up the existing owners ... i hope they are smarter than that ..t

 

[FISCALI]

they paid top dollar in the auction all that to produce few cars with limited warranty?
i thing this paragraph for the warranty its on paper only , to legally protecting them, .. i strongly believe that they will start offering real support and warranty as good KARMA

 

[dennis]

you mean the new 250 cars will have only $2k warranty .. who will buy a car with 2000$ warranty..? if that their new marketing strategy make new cars with limited warranty and screw up the existing owners ... i hope they are smarter than that ..t

It says Karmas existing as of this date and Seller's warranty obligations - in other words the already built Karmas, not their future production.

 

[Ira]

Wanxiang's main interest is building EVs for the Chinese market.

 

[asulil]

so assuming they produce 250 cars, the warranty per vehicle goes up to $5000 (assuming 2000 cars built at filing date) - thats $5000 more than a warranty that existed a month agao, plus you get a company actually making parts - it would seem this is a **** of a lot better than what exist - i realize it is not what was bargained for when you bought your car brand new - but its something.

as for battery cost - i am curious what the actual cost of the battery will be considering a123 is owned by wangxiang.
some reports are that Tesla is paying $180 /kwh - and their chemistry is more expensive (and more energy dense) (and toxic) than ours. I don't think $14K is the true cost tarts over $600 kWh.

see : http://www.greencarreports.com/news...-model-s-battery--and-what-it-may-cost/page-2

 

[Sigurd]

In the document "Case 13-13087-KG Doc 634-1 Filed 02/17/14 Page 2 of 70" on page 13 it states:
"1.10 Limited Warranty Program. Buyer hereby assumes and agrees to honor the
obligations of Sellers under the Sellers’ limited warranties on “Karma” sedans existing as of the
date hereof in an amount not to exceed (i) $2,000 per each vehicle warrantied or (ii) $400,000 in
the aggregate; provided that, at such point in time when Buyer and its Affiliates have restarted
commercial production of the “Karma” sedan (or substantially equivalent model under a
different name) and upon the production of the 250th such vehicle, the aggregate obligation set
forth in clause (ii) will be increased by $1,000,000."

The way I read this is that each existing owner (2000 of us) will get an up to $2000 warranty (for a total of up to $400K aggregate). Once they have produced 250 new cars, we will get an additional ($1 million) $5000 per car (additional $1 million divided by 2000 owners). That's a total of $7000 in restored warranty. That's $7000 more than most of us have now.

 

[dennis]

The way I read this is that each existing owner (2000 of us) will get an up to $2000 warranty (for a total of up to $400K aggregate). Once they have produced 250 new cars, we will get an additional ($1 million) $5000 per car (additional $1 million divided by 2000 owners). That's a total of $7000 in restored warranty. That's $7000 more than most of us have now.

Math errors:

2000*2000 = $4,000,000, not $400,000
$1,000,000/2000 = $500, not $5000

So the aggregate coverage is 1/10 of the maximum coverage per car.

 

[Don A]

The way I read this is that each existing owner (2000 of us) will get an up to $2000 warranty (for a total of up to $400K aggregate). Once they have produced 250 new cars, we will get an additional ($1 million) $5000 per car (additional $1 million divided by 2000 owners). That's a total of $7000 in restored warranty. That's $7000 more than most of us have now.

Sorry but these numbers are off by an order of magnitude. The cap is $2000 per car. At 200 cars times $2000 they reach the $400,000 so no more warranty claims until they produce 250 cars substantially like the Karma. At that point they add $1,000,000 in additional coverage, or another 500 vehicles at $2000 a piece. No additional coverage for the first 200 vehicles covered since the $2000 vehicle cap doesn't change.

 

[doug]

What kind of repairs can you realistically cover with $2000? Will those who have already paid for what should have been warranty work get a $2K reimbursement, or is this only for repairs going forward?

 

[Sigurd]

Should have used a calculator. Well that explains things. This is pretty much worthless. I guess the first 200 cars will benefit by $2000 and that's about it.

 

[SoCalGuy]

you mean the new 250 cars will have only $2k warranty .. who will buy a car with 2000$ warranty..? if that their new marketing strategy make new cars with limited warranty and screw up the existing owners ... i hope they are smarter than that ..t

No, the original Karmas. I presume that the new Karma2s will have full market warranties.

 

[SoCalGuy]

What kind of repairs can you realistically cover with $2000? Will those who have already paid for what should have been warranty work get a $2K reimbursement, or is this only for repairs going forward?

Well RDMs/TMs will be well in excess of that. Ditto for full batteries. But perhaps the $2K would cover 'preventative' maintenance like loctiting the splines of earlier builds that are prone to failure ("spinning out") and replacing bad battery modules (individual modules not the entire pack). I wonder however, if there will be a mad rush to get all of this stuff done before hitting the $400K cap. One would think, in the grand scheme that is surely to cost Wax HUNDREDS of millions, that they should have just sucked it up and agreed to cover up to $10K for all Karmas extant as of that date, or roughly $20M in total. Think about it. They just put up $150M to acquire FA (most of which was cash) plus they'll have to spend additional money on engineering and production restart, which I would speculate may be in the $50M range (assuming suppliers are on board). Atlantic will likely cost another $150-200M to bring to market. In the grand scheme of things, putting up a few extra $$$ to solidify a loyal owner base would have seemed like a no-brainer. Then again, FA and Wax aren't known for their 'brains' or savvy.