[cbermudez8]

As we all know too well, our Fisker Karmas are currently selling at about 50 cents on the dollar.

Just curious as to what you guys think is going to happen to the value of a Fisker Karma if and when the Elux Karma goes into production.

 

[steven]

I visited KBB.com to check on pricing of a used 2012 Porsche Panamera SE-Hybrid with 30K miles. It's just about 50 cents on the dollar against a new one. ($50,800 vs $100,500) It seems to me our Fiskers are holding up fine as far as used cars go. But I don't see them going up in value except for warehouse stored collector cars with zero miles in 10 years.... maybe.

 

[Eric Karma]

I visited KBB.com to check on pricing of a used 2012 Porsche Panamera SE-Hybrid with 30K miles. It's just about 50 cents on the dollar against a new one. ($50,800 vs $100,500) It seems to me our Fiskers are holding up fine as far as used cars go. But I don't see them going up in value except for warehouse stored collector cars with zero miles in 10 years.... maybe.

The difference however is that with the Porsche Panamera you have up to 3 more years (and 100k miles if Certified) of full factory warranty and road side service. A car 's value is based solely on what you can put in your pocket selling it and how much time and effort that takes. The lack of warranty and subsequent risk to the buyer (see the "I tried, I really tried post) makes selling a 30k mile Karma a bit more difficult than the same Panamera. To sell that Karma at $55k, you'll have to stumble upon an uninformed foolhardy buyer, or have a car that is mechaniically flawless. In either case, a more realistic selling price is $47k...more like 42%. Trading it in, you'll find out its real value; you'll get offers around $30k. I know all this from experience.

 

[JCMorrill]

It is a car you buy to love and hold onto. That way, you don't worry about the resale.

 

[Sigurd]

Eric, I'm sorry you made bad deals. I paid $100K exactly for mine, minus $7500 tax credit. My car has 25K miles and is in perfect condition. Green circles on the motors, perfectly functioning battery, new HVAC, etc. What do you think I could sell my car for? I bet my depreciation is less at this point than I would ever have gotten on a Panamera. I have had my car since December, 2011 and have not paid a penny for maintenance (including oil changes), repairs or even loaner cars. BTW, I'm not selling. I love my car.

 

[Eric Karma]

Eric, I'm sorry you made bad deals. I paid $100K exactly for mine, minus $7500 tax credit. My car has 25K miles and is in perfect condition. Green circles on the motors, perfectly functioning battery, new HVAC, etc. What do you think I could sell my car for? I bet my depreciation is less at this point than I would ever have gotten on a Panamera. I have had my car since December, 2011 and have not paid a penny for maintenance (including oil changes), repairs or even loaner cars. BTW, I'm not selling. I love my car.

I'm sorry to say Sigurd that I don't make bad deals. I extensively research each transaction before I make them. As a result I always come out ahead at purchase (and when applicable, at the sale). I paid $78K for my new Fisker in December 2012, when most buyers were still paying $95K or more for theirs. I am paying the least per month previously paid on a lease of my current vehicle...$1K/month x 36 months for a new $137K car; no money down; 12K miles/year).

It was only after having my Fisker on Autotrader.com for over a year at your imaginary (slowly depreciating) "fiskerbuzz member-inflated price" and not getting any buyers, that I came to my senses (not allowing love for an inanimate object to cloud my judgement) and sold it with 31K miles at its realistic price in the $40’s. Again, there are always foolhardy uniformed buyers who are "bitten by the bug" and make a poor decision. I wish you one when the time comes.

To answer your question, I believe with 25K miles you would currently pocket about $48-49K. I couldn’t find a 2012 Panamera on autotrader.com anywhere in the country for less than $52,895, AND that was a base V6 model with 28,500 miles (probable MSRP $90k).

When you do sell your car, please do post a copy of your bill of sale.

P.S. For the Fisker Blindly Faithful who post unknowingly:

http://www.autotrader.com/research/article/best-cars/212443/10-most-valuable-used-luxury-cars.jsp

10 Most Valuable Used Luxury Cars

#3 . Porsche Panamera

The 4-door Porsche Panamera sports car ranks third on our list at just above $70,000. Specifically, the Turbo model comes in third, while the V8-powered Panamera S ranks a little lower. There are several reasons why the Panamera boasts such a strong resale value, including desirability, sportiness and a high-end look and feel. But maybe the top reason is its Porsche heritage.


http://www.torquenews.com/1080/porsche-receives-3-kelley-blue-book-best-resale-value-awards

Porsche receives 3 Kelley Blue Book Best Resale Value Awards

Porsche has received three Best Resale Value Awards from KBB for the 2013 Porsche Cayenne and the 2013 Porsche Panamera, including a Top 10 Best Resale Value win. Kelley Blue Book (KBB.com) has released its 2013 picks for the Best Resale Value in various vehicle classes and two of the coveted spots have gone to Porsche for both the Cayenne SUV and the Panamera luxury car. The KBB awards are given every year based on the resale projections of the Kelley Blue Book Official Residual Value Guide, which is the most respected and influential used vehicle pricing guide on the market. Every year, awards are given by KBB to the latest-model vehicles they believe will retain their value best over the first five years of ownership. Porsche won in the Cayenne and Panamera's respective categories. In addition, the Cayenne was included in the Top 10 cars with Best Resale Value for 2013. That short list was topped by Best Brands Toyota and Lexus, but also included other brands like the Jeep Wrangler. The official list can be viewed here. The 2013 Porsche Cayenne came in #7 on the Top 10 list. The 2013 Porsche Cayenne is an all-new offering which comes with several power train options and a new S (sport) model which includes a new V8 engine offering more power and torque than the Turbo model. The 2013 Porsche Panamera is a sport sedan now offered in a new sport wagon with family-friendly seating options in a sporty car configuration. Porsche has offered concepts of the Panamera in hybrid and Sport Tourismo as well. The two Porsches are well-deserving of their KBB accolades.

Funny I couldn’t find any resale value awards for the Fisker Karma…did I miss them?

 

[steven]

Holy cow Eric, you have so much anger against Fisker that you still visit the forum even after you sold yours. I know there are two camps... Those of us who have had beautiful trouble-free cars and love them, and those who have beautiful troublesome cars who feel burned. I am pretty sure the former is the majority.

 

[FiskerPhilly]

Gotta let go...

 

[Sigurd]

Ok Eric. You say: "I paid $78K for my new Fisker in December 2012, when most buyers were still paying $95K or more for theirs." You bought a DEMO which gave you nothing but issues to the point that you complained about it for years. Then, after all your agony, you sold it for $40+K. And, you are still sore about it and Fisker. Even to the point that you are still wasting time here trying to prove a point. You might think you made a good deal. I think paying $95 for a fully functioning car that gives you years of pleasure is a good deal. Maybe you saved $17K initially, but see where it got you? You get what you pay for.

 

[Mr. Magoo]

If Elux comes the value will be the same or a little bit higher because zhe Elux will costs aprox 150.000 Dollars.

If Elux fails the value will increase because there are only aprox. 1500 Karmas world wide

In any case none of us will lose money on our car in the future

 

[cbermudez8]

I do not intend to sell my Fisker Karma but was curious as to what would happen should Elux renew production of the Karma. My thought was that the resale value of a Fisker Karma might increase for a few reasons. 1. Availability of replacement parts. 2. More availability of qualified service techs. 3. Exclusivity of Karmas with Fisker branding. 4. Announcement of CSP program.

 

[LonePalmBJ]

I do not intend to sell my Fisker Karma but was curious as to what would happen should Elux renew production of the Karma. My thought was that the resale value of a Fisker Karma might increase for a few reasons. 1. Availability of replacement parts. 2. More availability of qualified service techs. 3. Exclusivity of Karmas with Fisker branding. 4. Announcement of CSP program.

There's a fifth possible factor which is potentially increased recognition. Presumably when Elux starts up it will be accompanied by a PR and marketing campaign and maybe advertising. Awareness and familiarity will probably do more for the book value of our cars than the CSP program will.

 

[JCMorrill]

BTW - I don't think they're still thinking of using "ELUX" anymore. When we had dinner with the New Fisker Execs, they were asking if we thought the new Karmas should stay "Fiskers" or something else. But, they seemed to have heard the negative response to "Elux" and didn't really discuss that as a likely scenario.

 

[DHH]

This a bitter thread.

 

[Dave_Car_Guy]

In answer to the initial question, I am a firm believer that the re-introduction of the car will improve the RELATIVE value and sale-ability of the existing Fisker Karmas.

Note that I am not saying that our prices will go up from here, as these are depreciating in a manner not unlike most other cars made in 2011-2012. Rather, I am saying that the car in 2-3 years will be worth more at that point WITH the new cars being sold and serviced than it would otherwise, without the new car being re-introduced. That is merely because there will be continued service and parts available and people can have greater confidence in the longevity of the car

I have bought many cars both new and used. Most new cars take a 40-50% depreciation hit in 4-5 years of life. Some are better, some are worse. The Karma just did it faster than most, then flattened out a bit. Given everything that happened, it is a wonder that our cars did not drop 80%. Being "only" down 50-60% is a testament to the fact that most of these cars have performed extremely well, even without factory support and even though they had a great deal of new technology, and in large part due to the efforts of independent mechanics like the great ones on this forum.

Longer term, the Karma could easily become more valuable, (or at least hold value well) for its rarity, for its history in the electrification of the U.S./global auto business, and for its beauty and style.

I'm a bit biased on this subject, owning two Fiskers, the other one being one of only two existing Fisker Latigos in the world. I have a couple of "dogs in the race", and I am very patient with Latigo #001 and Karma #007 , both running just fine!

 

[steven]

BTW - I don't think they're still thinking of using "ELUX" anymore.

I didn't mind the eLux name, it was their horrible logo. If they stay with Fisker, at least they will probably have a nice "Style Guide" to follow created by a credible design firm to keep their brand in check.

 

[arv]

I sold my 2013 Karma today: price when new euro 136000 ( USD 150675- yes cars are expensive in the Netherlands)
I sold it for around euro 52500 ( USD 58000) Car was clean had
no issues and 20K kilometers. When I bought it the government heavily subsidized the car so the real cost for me was about half.

 

[DHH]

I think we should have you sell all of our cars in the Netherlands....

 

[steven]

I sold my 2013 Karma today.

Hi Arv,
Why did you sell? and what did you replace it with?

 

[Nin ja]

I think we should have you sell all of our cars in the Netherlands....

Why do you say "ALL our cars", I have no desire to sell and I'm a memeber of this forum!