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What is your current level of satisfaction with your Fisker Karma

  • Very Satisfied

    Votes: 57 67.1%
  • Somewhat Satisfied

    Votes: 19 22.4%
  • Neutral

    Votes: 3 3.5%
  • Somewhat Dissatisfied

    Votes: 4 4.7%
  • Very Dissatisfied

    Votes: 2 2.4%
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EX:Shadow/Canyon #324
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Given some recent posts, I thought it would be a good idea to take the pulse of the current owners participating on FiskerBuzz. Please respond to the poll with your overall level of satisfaction with your Fisker Karma as of today.

This poll is only for those of you who already own a Fisker Karma.
 

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I love my Karma. It's beautiful. It's fun to drive. It's comfortable. It gets gawkers even here in car-jaded Los Angeles. And so far I'm getting 152 MPG--a number that climbs every time I drive the car! I am so glad I bought the car!!!!
 

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well you guys already know my vote :)

mpg is deceiving because that could just mean you use your Karma to travel to the convenience store around the corner. I think I represent the typical consumer who drives around 20,000km per year and uses the car all year round. I am getting around 25 mpg and have had to fill up 3x since getting the car about a month ago. Of course I get the gawkers because there are only 23 of them in Ontario as far as I know but I didn't buy the car to be admired from, I bought it because I believe in the concept of extended range vehicles.

A good poll would be, how much of the total mileage capacity of one charge/fill up be attributed to electric power from a battery to call yourself an EV extended range car? On one extreme, would it be fair to say that you're an electric car if you can just go 1km on battery stored electricity and 499km on gas? I'm not saying that's the Karma but in reality (yes that's realistic driving) I am seeing from people posting that they are getting around 50km on a total range of 480km so that's around 10%... to me that wouldn't or shouldn't qualify as saying you're an EV extended range car. I think a better description is a fuel efficient electric motor run 2L turbo that has some electric range to it. I'd like to see a definition saying that there should be as much battery stored electric power as there is gasoline power... probably too much to ask for now but i have heard estimates that by 2015 we should have batteries capable of taking an average car 250km.
 

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I am getting around 25 mpg and have had to fill up 3x since getting the car about a month ago..... I think a better description is a fuel efficient electric motor run 2L turbo that has some electric range to it.
Interesting, since I have had my car for 11 months and have also filled it up just 4 times. And I have gone almost 4000 miles. You see, I drive about 35 miles a day when I do drive, and I plug it in every night. My MPG is an irrelevant number (something like 100 MPG). The point is better made that when I drive 35 miles, then plug it in, it costs me about $2.50 to go that 35 miles (at $0.15/kwh electricity costs). With gas around $4.50/gallon, my fuel cost per mile driven on electric is not quite half, so my "cost equivalent" MPG is more like 65 MPG. I have been on longer trips, and when I go to gasoline mode, I don't expect 45 mpg. This isn't a small econo car.

Clearly, the way you describe the car (a gas engine with some electric range added) is EXACTLY the way you use it. You say you drive 20000 km/year, meaning 1666 km a month, or about 1000 miles per month. If you have filled it up 3 times in your one month, as you say, then you have used probably 27 gallons of gasoline (the Karma's tank only holds 9.5 gallons of gasoline). That would suggest 1000/27 = 37 MPG. But you say 25 MPG so it must be that you drove less than that 1000 miles on your 3 tanks of gas. In any case... let's say 25 MPG. My wife's Lexus LS460 gets about 18 MPG, so you are still doing ok relative to large 4-door sedans. Not that MPG in that range would be a reason to specifically buy a car. But it wouldn't be a reason to DIS-like a car either.

More importantly, your driving results suggest to me that you have almost NEVER plugged it in. If you drive 1000 miles a month, as you say, and if you had plugged it in each night at your home, you would get 35 miles or so of range each day. Multiplied by 20 work days you should get at least 600-700 miles of gasoline-free driving...with the other 300 miles on gasoline (at 25 MPG, you would only then have used 10 gallons). If you NEVER plug in an electric car that is designed to run on electricity as it's MAIN fuel source, then of course you will be disappointed in the outcome. Then you are driving around a 5000 lb car whose extra 1000 lbs in batteries and generators aren't doing you any good. Nobody ever said this car would delight you with it's gasoline-only mode. It's designed to be plugged in.

So I don't fully understand your math, but I am challenged and maybe I am missing something? Like maybe a couple very long-range trips you took, or that you take regularly? E.g.: if your 1000 miles a month comes from Five discreet 200-mile trips, you only get to plug it 5 times, and you get 175 gas-free EV miles. The other 825 miles come in gas mode. But if someone else's 1000 miles comes in increments of 20 discreet trips of 50 miles, the result is very different, or in 30 trips of 33 miles, again very different. MPG can range from 23 MPG (never plug it in) to infinite.

In PHEVS, more so that in ANY TIME IN THE HISTORY OF THE AUTOMOBILE: your mileage will vary.

Oh, and you all know my answer to the poll: This is one of my favorite cars ever owned. I absolutely love it.
 

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Hockeydad,

In a few weeks I will have my Karma 1 year and will have driven ~ 11,000 miles or 18,000 km. I will have filled it up a total of 4 times. I drive it every day to and from work, round trip ~ 60 miles or 97 km. Almost all of it is freeway miles at 75 mph+.

I've also taken it on 200 mile golf outings many times. That's when I'm glad I have the extended range available. It is my daily driver, not a grocery getter.

Do you drive in sport mode most of the time?

I'm not trying to insult you but did the dealer spend much time with you explaining how stealth and sport mode works? This could make a big difference in your mileage.
 

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Dave_Car_Guy's number notes are, indeed, very interesting.

My "lifetime" (3 month) mileage on my Laguna Karma is a bit over 40 mpg, as my driving is mostly short local trips (2 to 20 miles) with occasional very-long trips (several of 140 miles, one of about 640 miles, for instance). The long trips have few if any plug-in opportunities and have contributed nearly half of my ~2000 miles of driving in 3 months.

Since the EV mileage is as close to infinite as one might want, and the gasoline mileage tends to be barely over 20 mpg (Karma reported 24 mpg on the >600-mile trip but measured by fill-ups it was under 22 mpg), the average of "a little over half electric, a little under half gas" is, unsurprisingly, a bit over 40 mpg.

I consider 40 mpg pretty darn good, given what kind of car I'm driving to get that!
 

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Are you sure you are driving a Fisker Karma?

well you guys already know my vote :)

mpg is deceiving because that could just mean you use your Karma to travel to the convenience store around the corner. I think I represent the typical consumer who drives around 20,000km per year and uses the car all year round. I am getting around 25 mpg and have had to fill up 3x since getting the car about a month ago.
@Hockeydad, I am starting to doubt that you even own a Karma. You know my drive profile: Just under 90 miles a day with 2 x full electric charges, and I am getting around 135 MPG. This is not going around the corner for groceries. I have logged over 11000 miles since Feb. 1, and most of the drive is at highway speeds of over 65 MPH. Even before my office installed the 220V chargers and I had to charge using 110V at work, I was averaging close to 80 MPG. Unless you are driving in Sport mode and uphill the entire time with your trunk full of steel bowling balls with the A/C on full blast the 25 MPG figure is completely inconsistent with my experience. Not really sure what to tell you. :confused:

And yes, I love my Karma, in case there was any doubt.
 

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My experience will soon be like most here -- commuting 50 miles round trip hopefully with charging both at home and at work so very little gas usage. But at the moment Apple only has about 15 charging stations to service 10-15 thousand employees (many more are supposedly imminent). My new garage is not yet in as advanced finish construction state as Dave_Car_Guy's, and the garage wiring in the old house I'm renting is old tattered extension cords I'm afraid to charge from.

So for another month at least I'm just operating the Karma in gas mode all the time and according to the dash getting 25mpg. Already done 2000 miles this way.

But guess what that's still 6mpg better than my DB9, plus if I'd bought a Tesla Model S instead I WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO DRIVE IT AT ALL RIGHT NOW EVEN IF I LOVED DRIVING IT AS MUCH AS THE KARMA. This is just one example of the flexibility and practicality of the Karma compared to pure EV. The pure EV are great for the dedicated, but with the Karma I don't have to plan my life around charging stations that may not be available. People at Apple with EVs have to constantly troll the parking lot waiting to see if someone else is done charging and broadcast emails asking people to move cars from the chargers just so they can get home. And this is in the middle of Silicon Valley I can't imagine how hopeless charging must be in the rest of the country!
 

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@Hockeydad, I am starting to doubt that you even own a Karma. You know my drive profile: Just under 90 miles a day with 2 x full electric charges, and I am getting around 135 MPG. This is not going around the corner for groceries. I have logged over 11000 miles since Feb. 1, and most of the drive is at highway speeds of over 65 MPH. Even before my office installed the 220V chargers and I had to charge using 110V at work, I was averaging close to 80 MPG. Unless you are driving in Sport mode and uphill the entire time with your trunk full of steel bowling balls with the A/C on full blast the 25 MPG figure is completely inconsistent with my experience. Not really sure what to tell you. :confused:

And yes, I love my Karma, in case there was any doubt.
FAB, This is exactly the thought that I had.....
 

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Hockeydad,

Are you able to just give your over all satisfaction? Let's say from 1-10, where one is poor and ten is wow,wow,wow???

Dennis, wasn't that your intention?


Stefan
 

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From 1-10. (Poor to wow) I really love my Karma @6


Stefan
 

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... So for another month at least I'm just operating the Karma in gas mode all the time and according to the dash getting 25mpg. Already done 2000 miles this way. ...
The command-center estimate always seems to be too high. Even so, you must be driving slower than I do. Then again there aren't many 80 mph speed limits in California. :D (Hmm ... should I admit to having gone substantially over the 80 mph speed limit? :angel:)

(Seriously, speed does hurt the mileage numbers, although the curve is gentler in my Karma than in my boxy SUV-ish station wagon.)
 

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My Karma has performed beyond my expectations since December 22nd, 2011. I have over 7K miles on it and I average around 300mpg. My commute is 37 miles round trip and I have between 5 and 10 miles of electricity left when I park it. I can routinely get 43-45 miles on a single charge if I drive the speed limit (60mph). If I drive hard and fast (70+mph), then I get home with 0 miles left. I live in Texas so the AC is used most of the year. On cold days I use the seat heaters primarily.
I have a feeling that people that are achieving less than 40mpg average in this car have not grasped the capabilities of this car and may not fully understand its intent. This car is the perfect car for everyday driving (commuting) and the occasional long trip. It is not a perfect road trip car any more than my Lambo is. I can hardly fit my wife's luggage in either one, let alone my overnight bag. But, that's what the minivan is for.
 

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EX:Shadow/Canyon #324
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
It is not a perfect road trip car any more than my Lambo is. I can hardly fit my wife's luggage in either one, let alone my overnight bag. But, that's what the minivan is for.
Or the back seat. :) I took a trip to Tahoe with 2 golf bags plus shoes in the trunk and 2 suitcases plus other gear in the back seat. Worked out fine, and a lot more fun than driving the SUV.
 

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EX:Shadow/Canyon #324
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Hockeydad,
Are you able to just give your over all satisfaction? Let's say from 1-10, where one is poor and ten is wow,wow,wow???

Dennis, wasn't that your intention?
Stefan
I think he did, and indicated he was Somewhat Dissatisfied.

I used these categories rather than 1-10 because it is how most customer/product satisfaction surveys are done.
 

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I do indeed own a Karma and if anyone would like to buy it, it's for sale. My km/l is now 27 but again, it's irrelevant. I reset the mileage stats at every fill up not knowing I should just 'leave the clock' running so I wont' reset it anymore but I've been doing everything possible to try and maximize the charge. At first, I was told not to use Hill mode, then I was told to use it, I was told not to charge it if it wasn't lower than 20% of capacity, now I charge it all the time. I don't charge it in between trips because I don't have access to a plug and also I'd be afraid that the charger would get stolen. All I can tell you is that when I drive it under normal conditions, I get 50-60km of range on what was sold to me as having 80km of range.

It's a $120k car so I shouldn't change my driving habits... or that's what I had felt and now that I'm just trying to make my car work so that I don't have to buy any gas at all, I am finding myself slowly crawling off the line and the gawks of "what a cool car!" goto confusion wondering why I'm going so slowly... I drive in Hill2 mode to get as much regeneration back and look far down the road so I drive as efficiently as possible and hardly touch my brake. Maybe it's the colder weather, maybe it's my battery but the dealer said my battery is good. He also said that they could drain the battery in 3 minutes at the practice lap if they wanted to and of course I don't do that but there definitely is a wide range of performance depending on how hard you drive the car.

The bottom line is that for those who are used to a certain driving style in an ICE car, it'll be hard for them to step into an EV, Fisker or not... battery technology needs to get better. As an early adopter, I'm not a very good consumer, I should not have bought this car especially given all the bugs. However, if Fisker is going to survive it needs to break out of this niche and into the general public where complaints like mine are going to more prevalent. If they do improve batteries, will Fisker give us the upgrade or make us pay $20-30k for it?
 

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Hockeydad I just don't quite get your absolutist thinking on the 80km battery capacity and range. That's peak not typical. The EPA rated it more like 52km electric range -- I think that's whats on the sticker. It's not a fully electric car like the Tesla so expecting to be able to run on battery 100% of the time is unrealistic, yet it's more convenient than the Tesla when you do exceed the battery range because gas stations are way more common than charging stations for the foreseeable future.

I don't think the typical consumer is going to be as hung up on this as you are--you're the only one on this board who has been so upset about this particular issue. Admittedly your expectations may have been set too high by the 80km number.

You're also trying to extrapolate your own expectation and frustration to the typical consumer and thereby predict the demise of the company. I hope you can understand your experience is not necessarily typical so it's not really fair to Fisker or rest of us owners when you do that.
 

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Hockydad,

"mpg is deceiving because that could just mean you use your Karma to travel to the convenience store around the corner."

When you buy a car you should know your driving overall experiences, and what the car will be used for. That's why there are a variety of choices. If a person buys a Karma to "travel to the convenience store around the corner..", that's his choice. Personally, I've lived in the Dallas/Ft. Worth metroplex for over 32 years and have never driven farther. As an airline pilot, my wife and I enjoy reduced fare air travel, consequently we fly everywhere and rent a car upon arrival. Great time saver, with more time at the destination.
I've worn out several cars in those 32 years, and yes, I do use the Karma to go to the convenience store around the corner, and anyplace else I choose to go. It pleases me to drive the car, and in that vein, I don't especially care what the mpg is. It's just a great car. Te each his own.

Put me down as very satisfied.
 

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@pythagoras
hmmm, my absolutist thinking? I guess you could call it that if that were the case but that is how I was sold the car. I think I'm your average consumer that drives their kids around to different events, to work, to get groceries etc and I expect value for my money when I buy an expensive car. It's really that simple...

@ Bert,
very true... early adopters need to understand the range issues and with technology the way it is, it's not for everyone. This is why I think hybrids will be the answer until battery technology can get you 500km and have a recharge time of less than 15 minutes. I don't think a car should be deemed a true extended range electric vehicle if it only has the capacity to run less than 20% of its range off the battery... that just isn't to me. It should be called a fuel efficient gas engine with some electric range :)

I'd agree to the point about it being a great car if it weren't for so many glitches and again when you pay $120k for a car, you need to compare it to the other cars you can buy for that money and this is the main reason why I think Fisker is in trouble... the early adopter market is very small. Fisker needs to give the general public an extra reason to try their car, it needs to go above and beyond as it is under capitalized compared to its peers...
 

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@Hockeydad

1. For its looks and luxury the Karma is competitively priced to the sexy sports tourers e.g. Maserati, Aston Martin, and Porsche Panamera. There's another class of luxury cars in the high $90k with lots more electronic gizmos than styling like your high-end Mercedes, Audi, BMW, etc. In some ways Fisker isn't competitive to those but neither is any other supercar priced over $100k. Maybe you would be happier with one of those.

2. It makes no absolutely no engineering sense at the current time to build a hybrid where the battery supplies half the range. That means the battery weight and size have to at least double, adding several hundred more pounds and leaving no room for any sort of engine. You either carry a huge heavy battery around like Tesla to round out the range, or an engine. Not both.
With drastic improvement in battery technology that equation may change but for now that's the reality.
 
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