[scottf200]

Exclusive: Fisker Plans Entry Level Car To Take On Chevrolet Volt. General Motors - 14 mins ago by Jay Cole
http://insideevs.com/exclusive-fisk...car-to-take-on-chevrolet-volt-general-motors/

InsideEVs has learned that Fisker, in a presentation to investors earlier this year, has said it has plans for a third entry level offering. A model which would take on General Motors.

This third car would be still be an EVer, which is Fisker’s own terminology for an extended range hybrid, and would be off an all new platform, internally called the “P Platform”.

Where Fisker sees the Karma competing against the high end offerings of BMW, Mercedes and Audi (think 7 series, A8), and the Atlantic taking on the mid-grade versions of the same manufacturers (think 3 series, 5 series, C & E Class, A6, etc), this new P-platform car was demonstrated by Fisker to specifically be pitted against General Motors in the “entry level premium segment”.
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[doug]

The article says this vehicle would likely be with a partner. I'm still not seeing what technology Fisker has to offer a partner. We'll have to see what they come up with in their "second generation" drivetrain that is said to be in their N Platform (that includes the Nina/Atlantic).

An "entry level" vehicle is a logical step, but Fisker has a few to complete before getting to that one.

 

[dennis]

The article says this vehicle would likely be with a partner. I'm still not seeing what technology Fisker has to offer a partner. We'll have to see what they come up with in their "second generation" drivetrain that is said to be in their N Platform (that includes the Nina/Atlantic).

Given that their are only two other PHEV drivetrains currently being delivered (Chevy Volt and Prius Plugin) a fully developed one from Fisker could give time-to-market advantages to a partner. I believe it is wrong to discount the engineering that Fisker has done to make the PHEV drivetrain completely seamless and proven in production use.

 

[doug]

Given that their are only two other PHEV drivetrains currently being delivered (Chevy Volt and Prius Plugin) a fully developed one from Fisker could give time-to-market advantages to a partner. I believe it is wrong to discount the engineering that Fisker has done to make the PHEV drivetrain completely seamless and proven in production use.

I'd say even the Prius Plug-in doesn't count. That's more of a hybrid plus, rather than a car that has a proper EV mode. The Voltec drivetrain is what Fisker should aspire to (in terms of ICE integrated with EV - efficiency, NVH, etc) and hopefully with the ELR, GM can come up with a higher performance version.

I've said before that as an engineer/physicist, I'm not terribly impressed with the Karma drivetrain (nor with their drivetrain partner Quantum Technologies). To me it's brute force, compromised, and poorly integrated. But you are correct in that there is much knowledge gained in the process of doing, so I hold out hopes for their rumored "second generation" drivetrain.

So assuming there is a successful launch of the Atlantic, proving this second gen drivetrain (which is also said to be going into future Karmas), then maybe Fisker will have something more attractive to offer a partner.

I do think, however, that Fisker needs to become successful at the high end before they try to compete in the entry-level. One step at a time.

 

[dennis]

I've said before that as an engineer/physicist, I'm not terribly impressed with the Karma drivetrain (nor with their drivetrain partner Quantum Technologies). To me it's brute force, compromised, and poorly integrated. But you are correct in that there is much knowledge gained in the process of doing, so I hold out hopes for their rumored "second generation" drivetrain.

So assuming there is a successful launch of the Atlantic, proving this second gen drivetrain (which is also said to be going into future Karmas), then maybe Fisker will have something more attractive to offer a partner.

I agree that the 1.0 (Karma) drivetrain is exactly that - a 1.0. While the packaging is definitely brute force, the owner experience is completely seamless: both battery<->ICE and regen<->friction braking.

I doubt that Fisker is talking about their 1.0 to any potential partner, as they have said that 90% of the engineering for their 2.0, the Atlantic, has been completed. Having 1500 cars on the road has provided Fisker engineers with a lot of real world experience and potential improvements. They don't have to have the Atlantic in the marketplace to attract a partner; they just need to be able to convince them that the 2.0 drivetrain is compelling.

 

[rex]

Intriguing. Five seats might get me to buy another one.

 

[scottf200]

Given that their are only two other PHEV drivetrains currently being delivered (Chevy Volt and Prius Plugin) a fully developed one from Fisker could give time-to-market advantages to a partner. I believe it is wrong to discount the engineering that Fisker has done to make the PHEV drivetrain completely seamless and proven in production use.

Ford has some skin in this game. The C-Max hybrid (non-plugin) outsold the Prius countrerpart in it's *1st* month. (47 MPG?)

There is a C-Max Energi which is the plug-in version (43 MPG?). That had minor sales of 144 but is just getting started. Bottom line a lot of tech in these cars and a lot of clout behind them. The C-Max Energi is unique in that it can go up to 85 MPH in EV mode vs most other at 62 MPH (100 km/h). In other words real freeway driving.