[Nin ja]

Ricciardi #0947

 

[Nin ja]

We have our answer from Karma Automotive:



While I am not exactly shocked at the response, I am nevertheless very disappointed that Karma Automotive has chosen to orphan the original cars' CIU and move on to greener pastures. This is not a good day for Karma owners, and I wonder if the Revero owners will be in our shoes in few years.

It's not like the current karma does not stil have issues and based on what they are saying, they are still responsible for any "faults" the vehicles may have -- okay I can live with that. The current CIU is not much and I use it very little -- found work around with my IPHONE. As long as they continue to support the parts, that something!

 

[Nin ja]

I was told at the Atlanta Revero event by Joost that this will never happen. No update planned on a Fisker. They want you to buy the new car. Did you ever send this @Fabulist?

he did, their loss, i'll wait for fiskers new car and maybe he'll do some after market stuff when he gets up and running. hopefully he'll partner with powersource and fiskerphilly !!!!

 

[Nin ja]

Here is the reason Joost gave me way they would never do it. He said something as follows:

Let's say we did allow this and you update the car software. Well now you sell it to a new owner. He didn't ok this 3rd party software and something goes wrong with the car or causes an accident. They could sue Karma as liable for ok'ing the 3rd party use. He said it opens the door to issues and liabilty they don't want. He said at some point we have to say ok, we gave you the 535 update and now is time to upgrade the car to the new Revero if you want more.

He was very nice about it and believes they are doing right. He did say there is no one named Julian at Powersource and said his real name to me. He said he was bypassing things on the car that they don't understand with the TOM and he didn't have anything positive to say about them. He didn't bash @PowerSource, he was polite yet stern on the fact that one should be careful when modifying the Fisker. He said he has over 87K on his Fisker and loves it, but it's time now for the Revero...the car that should have been released by Fisker.

It is disappointing they wont update the car, but I understand Karma's position. When I bought the car I knew it had issues, I knew it wasn't a super fast car, and I knew nothing looked better! I bought the car for the beauty, the rarity, and the joy it brings me. Can I live the with the issues? WITHOUT A DOUBT! I love my car. I feel Joost was honest and everyone I met from Karma was friendly and helpful. They respected me as a Fisker owner and loved talking to me about MY car, the joy I have and my Laguna Blue color.

I enjoyed my experience, but I would not buy one until they get a lot more EV miles out of the battery.

operative word "but it's time now for the Revero" and "the car that should have been released by Fisker". where was Joost when the only people servicing the car was smoothoperator (aka powersource) , Harlyguy, Alexpop and Fiskerphilly? they learned more about the car then many can imagine and they have been there for the abandon owner. When you pick up a kid from fostehome and then have your own kid, you don't starve the foster kid because you have a new child? oh, i have a new child now and i fed him till he was 12, but now i got my own and don't want to feed him anymore -- WTF? They can release the software to an open source and rid themselfs of the liability -- what he says is total BS -- it's called an identification clause people sign when they accept something -- and the responsible person for his example is the seller who does not disclose. As an original owner I want to thank KA for the food they game me when they picked me up from foster care, but now that they want to throw me out, I'll have to make my own way -- hey powersource what cooking on the grill these days, there a few hundred fiskerkids needing some love and care !!!!!

 

[Nin ja]

"Someone may sue us" is probably the weakest and laziest excuse for not doing something in business, and I am saying that as a practicing lawyer. In my experience, if a company wants to do something, they find a way to mitigate or contain the risk. I don't think any lawyer has ever talked any CEO out of doing something the CEO wanted to do for business reasons, regardless of the risk. But when a business executive does not want to do something, their go-to excuse is that that it may lead to a lawsuit, and "the lawyers" advised them not to do it.

The fact is that just existing in the US can expose you to lawsuits, that's part of the business risk of operating any company. In my personal opinion (no legal advice here) Karma's excuse is pretty weak, for a variety of reasons. Following their logic, any car maker could be potentially liable for any modification to any car, simply because the car maker did not make it impossible for the owner to add after-market parts to their cars. That's not how product liability law works. an unauthorized modification actually provides a defense to what is typically a strict liability case of product defect. In addition, the CIU code does not operate any safety system in the car and the chances of it causing an accident is pretty miniscule.

Yes, you can sued for pretty much any reason in the US, but if that risk alone was enough to stop business people, we will still be sitting in caves banging rocks together.

I wish KA well, but now that they kick us (fisker owners) out of the "karma family" I'll take my car and business to those who "fed" us while we roamed the street as orphans. I hope FISKER INC. does well and finds a way to have convince KA to remove the "ball and chain" from our feet and let us go home to papa - I hear him calling us!

 

[Nin ja]

With all this being said, why does Karma Automotive continuously bash us, publicly? Hard to let that go when we have not done anything wrong or in conflict. I cannot agree with the goodwill part, in whole. Looking at the multitude of issues that the new software has caused (many forum posts). I.e. BL530 removing battery balancing and 535 causing blinking ready lights, which require hard resets etc. There are many many forum posts which outline these issues.

We have spent hundreds of thousands in litigation with Karma and now finally have a judgement for many hundreds of thousands against them. Perspective is a h_e_l_l of a thing!

good on you, somehow i think the Joost wing at KA has more to do with this then the Jim wing of KA. I just wish they (KA) knew we were all on the same team. I hope to god they come to their senses, otherwise they will be OBE -- my two cents! I SUPPORT POWERSOURCE !

 

[Nin ja]

Our intention is that any further negotiation with Karma will include a provision that this CIU software is released into the open source. It does not do anybody any good for it to be locked away in some safe where owners suffer with buggy CIU's. Karma has abandoned the 2012 CIU and the owners should have a right to fix the egregious bugs that reside within this subsystem.

Enough is enough, it is time for us owners to take control of our destiny; rather than leave it in the hands of Karma.

All owners deserve a functional CIU, free of charge. That is what we all paid for when we bought the car.

U have my support, let me know how to participate !

 

[Nin ja]

Best thing you can do or any owner is to keep giving feedback to your dealer and the manufacturer directly. It is not right for them to do this.

Also we are banned from the official forum but I heard that Karma claims they are having legal conversations with us. There are no legal conversations, that is a lie. At this point we have a minute order against Karma. They sued us in federal court to try to put pressure on us. That obviously did not work. Now they are making up lies about legal conversations. The only communication I am aware of is a frivolous lawsuit that they filed.

I have been vocal and even though I supported their efforts - long conversation with jim and minimal with joast ( he seemed very sly to me) - i even put my two cents in a video they asked me to do whixh they never aired- given their action since 535 , i see their actions as abandonment and i signed the patition both on this boatd and on the karmaitomotive site - i hope their ceo and jim talor have more say - they both seemed level headed! Lets hope they reconsider, otherwise they can kiss many brand ambassadors good bye!

 

[Nin ja]

Their CEO (tom Corcoran chairman of A123) and Jim taylor basically control the company. Joost will not likely say anything that has not been fed to him by these two individuals. Likely the information you are being fed is from Tom himself through Joost the messenger. YMMV. Just my opinion Perhaps you should try to call the CEO himself and ask him what he thinks. Their number is on their site. Lets see what happens!

You know this seems reasonable. You think a formal letter would be more effective? I think most owners SHOULD drive a message directly to leadership, heck why not the Chairman on WanXing ?

 

[Nin ja]

Mainly to keep shaming Karma Automotive. Last I checked, people were still signing the same petition on KA’s website as well.

really, i don't go to the KARMA site anymore -- what a shame what they have done -- hope pwrsrc start to sell the CIU at some point , so I can update my car.

 

[Nin ja]

Pretty much this is a dead thread we’re never going to see a upgrade sorry to say. Karma Automotive at this point is having enough troubles themselves. The farist thing on their minds is the Karma

which goes to reason, release the darn software Jim and Joust and get some good will from loyal fisker owners who can not in good conscious recommend doing business with KARMA AUTOMOTIVE unless they start showing signs to support our community.

 

[Nin ja]

Next best thing almost done- retrofitting the Revero infotainment in the 2012 cars. Some minor details that need to be fixed but a marked improvement, for sure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Otvcyh3gW1c

When should I make an appointment with Joe ? Standing by!!!!!!!!