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Old 08-02-2015, 09:33 PM   #11 (permalink)
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@JCMorrill when the ICE fires up at random for an OBD check it doesn't charge the battery much above maintaining. However with 520 software the ICE will not run no matter what above 95% SOC (don't quote me on the percentage). The important concept is that this will prevent misfires caused from an OBD forced GEN start at high battery level.
@Nin ja
Mike this will not be available at CSP providers at this point These upgrades are being developed separate of Fisker. Whether or not Fisker adopts any of this, I will make it available here at my place. @PowerSource is working on some amazing stuff.
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Old 08-02-2015, 10:26 PM   #12 (permalink)
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What is the result? Is it more or less efficient to run the ICE (low level), to recharge the car in "background" stealth, or place in SPORT mode.
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Old 08-03-2015, 01:41 PM   #13 (permalink)
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What is the result? Is it more or less efficient to run the ICE (low level), to recharge the car in "background" stealth, or place in SPORT mode.
I find it very hard to believe that charging your battery from ICE is more efficient than an Electric Utility Power-plant. I can understand however, that if you are out of electricity, it makes sense to charge the battery enough to shut off the engine when you are coasting or standing still for better fuel efficiency while on ICE... like a Prius Hybrid.
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Old 08-03-2015, 02:12 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I guess I need more info. The original software (as I recall), allowed the driver to put in SPORT mode and maintain battery at the same level where placed in SPORT mode -- i.e.: if placed in Sport at 40 mile SOC, the ICE would maintain that SOC. After 512 (i think), the Software only allowed the SOC to be maintained in SPORT at 26 Miles or less. Supposedly this was to meet certain emission standards and optimize efficiency. At any rate with the 50 miles of max STEALTH, it wasn't a big deal, since I drive in STEALTH locally and use SPORT on trips. Thus the question "is it more economically to background charge the battery. It would appear that charging less than the miles driven, would reduce the SOC over time. My hope was always battery technology, that would allow the STEALTH EV driving range extended -- Rumors of 100+ were floating about before A123 went belly up and then Fisker.

Any technical evaluation would be appreciated.

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Old 08-03-2015, 03:53 PM   #15 (permalink)
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@JCMorrill when the ICE fires up at random for an OBD check it doesn't charge the battery much above maintaining. However with 520 software the ICE will not run no matter what above 95% SOC (don't quote me on the percentage). The important concept is that this will prevent misfires caused from an OBD forced GEN start at high battery level.
@Nin ja
Mike this will not be available at CSP providers at this point These upgrades are being developed separate of Fisker. Whether or not Fisker adopts any of this, I will make it available here at my place. @PowerSource is working on some amazing stuff.
thanks Joe -- When 5:30 comes in and/or before november I'll make arrangements to get my car to you and then we can discuss any of the upgrades.
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Old 08-03-2015, 06:01 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Yes. Battery and charging time upgrades also being developed and test versions are being used. This being done for the original karma by independent developer. Any new technology implemented in the new karma would be done by Fisker and A123 but not likely retroactive or compatible with old karma.
@AIJohn it is not as efficient overall, but some would like the ability to just add to the range by using some fuel.
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:10 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Thanks @FiskerPhilly and @PowerSource. This is definitely interesting stuff. I would also be interested to know if the 6.6 kWh OBCM will be available from New Fisker. Once the Elevate program has been finalized, I think it will be easier for owners of the 2012 Karmas to decide if they want to modify their Karmas with "after-market" enhancements like this (at least that's my perspective). Also, whether the closest CSP we can use will support these after market enhancements is another key question.

On the original post topic, I am curious if charging the HV battery at a stand-still using this modification is more fuel efficient than charging while driving. I ask that as it would seem like the generator creates a certain amount of juice when running the engine. If you're recharging the HV battery faster while stopped, then it would seem like you would use less fuel in this scenario than recharging while driving as you're not competing with the energy demands that the keeping the 5300 lbs of the Karma moving (and re-starting from stops) create.

OK, my head hurts now from trying to explain the thoughts running through my brain on this...
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:33 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Thanks @FiskerPhilly and @PowerSource. This is definitely interesting stuff. I would also be interested to know if the 6.6 kWh OBCM will be available from New Fisker. Once the Elevate program has been finalized, I think it will be easier for owners of the 2012 Karmas to decide if they want to modify their Karmas with "after-market" enhancements like this (at least that's my perspective). Also, whether the closest CSP we can use will support these after market enhancements is another key question.

On the original post topic, I am curious if charging the HV battery at a stand-still using ...
@watt gas there is a much more mathematical explanation but at idle, the GEN SET uses a certain "X" amount of fuel to charge. However at idle the Gen can only product a minimal amount of energy to recharge. In no cases is the car more efficient with the GEN recharging the battery when compared to plugin. However if you charge at idle, vs driving, the idle charging is certainly more efficient as you remove the energy demand required to drive the car. However, idle loaded generator with AC on a hot day could pose a thermal cooling issue with airflow required to keep all the radiators happy.
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:44 PM   #19 (permalink)
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For anything over 20 amps (OBCM) the wiring will have to be changed from the charge-port to the OBCM (currently 12-14GA) and can only draw max ~20A. The Amphenol connector will also need to be changed so basically a new harness would be required (and relocated) unless the OEM solution is paralleling two of the current Delta 3.3's together.

For the other question, actually more miles can be generated while driving (and more efficiently) vs standstill. From our cycle tests of the Karma the HCU has a load following setup where a torque command is sent based on immediate demand this is why you hear the engine rev up and down like a conventional vehicle- our charge controls follow a maximum efficiency logic (a hybrid model of base load and load following).
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Old 08-03-2015, 09:53 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Thanks for the answers on both questions. So it doesn't sound promising that the 6.6 kWh OBCM will be offered, but I'll wait and see.
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